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Jamie Kellner, chairman and CEO of Turner Broadcasting (an AOL Time Warner company), was recently interviewed by [INSIDE] on the future of television (Content's King). In the interview, Mr. Kellner said some very interesting things, including characterizing those who skip television commercials as thieves:
[Ad skips are] theft. Your contract with the network when you get the show is you're going to watch the spots. Otherwise you couldn't get the show on an ad-supported basis. Any time you skip a commercial or watch the button you're actually stealing the programming.
To help develop Mr. Kellner's unfortunately common (at least in Hollywood) view of copyright, LawMeme offers the top ten new copyright crimes, as well as further choice quotes and commentary from Mr. Kellner's interview.
FOLLOWUP 2359 08 May 2002
LawMeme has an analysis of a new report that shows that PVRs are not as bad for TV advertising as thought (Study: PVRs Not Necessarily the Death of TV Advertising).
10. Watching PBS without making a donation.
You know who you are, you cheap ...
9. Changing radio stations in the car when a commercial comes on.
Future radios will prevent listeners from changing channels when a commercial comes on. The RIAA has not yet taken a position on whether it is permissible to switch channels when the listener doesn't like the song.
8. Channel Surfing during commercials, especially with Picture-in-Picture capability.
Similar to radio, skipping through channels, particularly when combined with picture-in-picture (which permits viewers to know precisely when an ad block ends), will be prohibited.
7. Getting into a movie after the previews, but just in time for the main feature.
Theaters will be required to close their doors once the advertising and previews have begun. The MPAA has not yet taken a position on time-in-seat requirements for advertising in the pre-preview slide show or whether audiences should be compelled to watch the credits at the end of the movie.
6. PBS
How can commercially sponsored broadcast networks compete with a government sponsored network?
5. Inviting friends over to watch pay-per-view.
When you call to authorize viewing, you will be required to indicate the number of people present to watch. Compliance will be monitored and viewers must identify themselves.
4. Blocking pop-up ads on the Internet.
Yeah, Mozilla and Opera users, this means you!
3. Not buying things from the advertisers on television shows.
Part of your contract is that not only do you watch the advertisements, but that you subsequently buy from the advertisers. If you don't buy from the advertisers, the whole system breaks down.
2. Watching MTV if you are older than 35 or Matlock reruns if you are younger than 40.
Advertisers buy ads to reach a particular demographic. If you aren't part of that demographic you are, effectively, a thief.
1. Libraries and librarians.
This is why we have the Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organization (RICO) Act.
Seriously, Kellner, who is a very powerful man, has said some truly disturbing things in his interview. Not merely once, or off-the-cuff, but multiple times in many different ways. At least Kellner is reasonably straight forward in his intentions, unlike Jack Valenti.
Kellner on bathroom breaks:
I guess there's a certain amount of tolerance for going to the bathroom. But if you formalize it and you create a device that skips certain second increments, you've got that only for one reason, unless you go to the bathroom for 30 seconds. They've done that just to make it easy for someone to skip a commercial.
Here, of course, he is referring to the ReplayTV 4000, which can skip forward in 30 second increments and has already been sued (basically, using Kellner's theory). Of course, note that there is only "a certain amount of tolerance." Go to the bathroom too much and you are a thief.
Kellner on Sony v. Universal, i.e. the Betamax case
Our company is working on a number of different VOD [Video on Demand] models. The question's whether these are going to be head-end-based models or in-home models and whether ultimately there's going to be a license required for use of the copyrighted material, or whether people make a bet the Betamax case can cover this usage. My bet would be the Betamax case is not going to cover this usage. What was a highly questionable decision with the new technology will not stand up to the potential of the digital world. Whether there's going to be a challenge or whether it's going to be legislation, there's going to be some way in the digital world that we can protect copywritten material. I think that that's inevitable....
Again, I think that whether it's legislation, whether it's new technology, whether it's challenging Betamax, whatever it is in the video marketplace, we're going to have to find a way to protect copywritten material or there will be less of it made or it will not be made available in windows where it's not protectable and that's not good for consumers, so there's got to be some way it's protected.
Basically, Kellner is challenging the legitimacy of Sony v. Universal, which made it clear that VCRs are legal. While most copyright owners claim not to want to interfere with the right of citizens to time shift, Kellner does away with the pretense. In his view, Sony "was a highly questionable decision" in the first place.
Kellner on Napster
The audio marketplace--Napster and other companies had a great game going. They figured out how to use the Internet to give music away that they didn't own and make it into a business. Everyone was planning on getting rich there at one point. The companies that are financing and own copyrights stepped in and challenged it, and it's not a very rosy picture for them right now. I think the idea of copyright is very important--and it's respected by the courts and our government--and as people realize the potential of what the Internet with digital can do in terms of distribution, I think there's a good decision to be made that will protect the copyright.... Someone's going to have to recognize that once we've entered the digital world people can send out perfect copies without any costs to large numbers of people in many different territories of the world [and] can dramatically disrupt the system that we've built that allows us to produce and distribute content and pay for it and make...a profit in the investment, and that has to be addressed.
What has to be addressed? Copyright infringement is illegal. The Napster case was decided (mostly correctly) on established copyright law. There will be disruptions in distribution chains, but that is the beauty of capitalism. Robert Heinlein said it well:
There has grown up in the minds of certain groups in this country the notion that because a man or a corporation has made a profit out of the public for a number of years , the government and the courts are charged with the duty of guaranteeing such profit in the future, even in the face of changing circumstances and contrary public interest. This strange doctrine is not supported by statute nor common law. Neither individuals nor corporations have any right to come into court and ask that the clock of history be stopped ,or turned back, for their private benefit. - "Life-Line"
Kellner on Innovation
I encourage innovation, and I believe that we should try to satisfy the marketplace, make it as easy and convenient for people to get what they want out of their cable subscriptions, so I'm all for that. I'm for multiplex and multiplay because in many ways it does a similar thing, and it doesn't add in the cost of VOD. It's sort of half a step in the same direction for those who don't want to take the full step, and it's something that can be done relatively quickly and easily. But I'm certainly not opposed, and I encourage the idea of exploring new models with new technology that make it better for people. At the same time, we have to make sure we don't damage the existing businesses, whether it's pay-per-view business--what does it do to that on the cable side--and that we don't damage the advertising-supported networks, cable and broadcast.
The problem with capitalism, see, is that in creating new markets you usually destroy older markets. Kellner and Hollywood just don't seem to understand that. As Copyfight put it more eloquently (Speak Softly and Carry a Big Sledgehammer), Hollywood has fallen in love with the creative and distribution possibilities of the Internet, but feel betrayed that those same possibilities will destroy many of their existing business models.
Kellner on Contracts
I've spoken out about this a number of times. Again, it doesn't handle the deal that exists. The only payment for a lot [of content] is the willingness of the viewer to watch the spot, the commercial. That's part of the contract between the network and the viewer. For anybody to step in between that content and encourage the viewer to disregard the payment in time that he's making--I think everybody should fight those people...or let the viewer have a subscription model where they pay for that, in which case the monies can be taken in and distributed back to cover the loss of the ad revenue. This is the time to honestly address it; also, for people to deal with it. If you think it's something that's good for consumers, give them the choice of either watching the commercials or paying incremental money for the service and make sure that people in the business understand the economic damage they can do by licensing this product.
Will someone please send this man to business school? No one is forcing Turner to use their free broadcast airwaves. Turner is perfectly free to stick with subscription cable revenues. If they don't like the characteristics of a particular medium, they don't have to use it. No medium can force their readers to pay attention to advertisements (newspaper, radio, movies, etc.). What makes television different?
Kellner on how television won't change
I don't think [PVRs] changes the way you make programming. I think it may change the way you market programming. If you have something you really, really believe in and you have a large installed base of PVRs out there, you may be willing to invest a lot more money on the launching and the marketing just to get the PVR/VOD viewer to go home and log in to receive the show because you can probably get a lot of additional viewership. If you're against tough competition, you could put a program against Friends and if there's a large PVR base you could try to pick up people who are still going to watch Friends, but will you watch the next half-hour, the next hour? You pick up People magazine and see this ad for a new show and you see a lot of promotion on the air and if it's a good enough idea maybe you go home and log in on your PVR. You may get very aggressive at promotion because you have two shots at getting people there versus one.
If I were Turner, I would seriously consider firing this guy. Of course PVRs will change the way you make programming. Fragmented special audiences require different types of production than the nearly monolithic television audiences of the past. Based on Kellner's theory, cable shouldn't have changed the way programming was made either. Formal networks are dying, and will die (unless courts or legislators change things). Even Kellner's own innovations, such as multi-casting (showing the same show more than once a week or on two or more channels), have changed the way shows are produced. Sheesh, no wonder AOL-TW stock is so depressed.
Kellner on people as means to his ends and not as ends in themselves
This is from a letter Jamie Kellner wrote to fans of Seventh Heaven, explaining that viewers are commodities to be sold to advertisers, "Selling high volumes of 18-34 adults to advertisers does not mean we aren't very excited about reaching a broader audience ..." (LUV-7H Correspondence with James Kellner).
Additional Resources
A number of other sites have picked up on the controversy: Slashdot, of course (Turner CEO: "PVR Users Are Thieves"). Kuro5hin leads off its post on the subject (Turner CEO says: If you avert your eyes, you are stealing!) with a highly appropriate quote:
...And viddy films I would. Where I was taken to, brothers, was like no cine I'd been in before. I was bound up in a straight-jacket and my gulliver was strapped to a headrest with like wires running away from it. Then they clamped like lidlocks on my eyes so I could not shut them no matter how hard I tried. It seemed a bit crazy to me, but I let them get on with what they wanted to get on with. If I was to be a free young malchick in a fortnight's time, I would put up with much in the meantime, my brothers... -- Alex, from A Clockwork Orange
The Shifted Librarian's bank account is already getting a work out (The Shifted Librarian: Content's King). Go to TiVo Community (aka "the Den of Thieves") for some heartfelt responses (News: Turner CEO calls TiVo "Theft").
U.S.S. Clueless's Den Beste has a few choice things to say (Contracts and Obligations), as does Cory Doctorow (Hollywood fatcat calls TiVo use "theft").
Unrelated to the current flap is another website, which is the number two google result for "Jamie Kellner", a website entitled, "J. Kellner, Source of All Evil".
Interestingly, AOL-TW owns part of TiVo (TiVo Partners). But, we all know that things are not going very well inside AOL-TW.
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"User's Login" | Login/Create an Account | 104 comments |
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Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes (Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Thursday, May 02 @ 14:38:32 EDT | What if you fast forward through the plot of porn movies to the good parts? |
[ Reply to This ]
- Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Thursday, May 02 @ 15:17:00 EDT
- Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Friday, May 03 @ 16:47:19 EDT
- Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Friday, May 03 @ 19:25:05 EDT
- Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Sunday, May 05 @ 13:37:32 EDT
- Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Monday, May 06 @ 11:21:41 EDT
- Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Monday, May 06 @ 19:50:25 EDT
- Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Monday, May 06 @ 19:51:43 EDT
- Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Tuesday, May 07 @ 18:56:38 EDT
- Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Wednesday, May 08 @ 00:12:47 EDT
- Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Wednesday, May 08 @ 13:55:31 EDT
- Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Thursday, May 09 @ 17:07:58 EDT
- Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Thursday, May 09 @ 20:20:48 EDT
- Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Saturday, May 11 @ 19:57:10 EDT
"That's part of the contract between the network and the viewer." (Score: 1, Insighful) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Friday, May 03 @ 09:14:41 EDT | That's odd... I don't remember signing a contract with any of the local broadcasters when I moved to this area, or bought a house, or bought an antenna, or bought a TV. Where is this so called "Contract," who signed MY NAME, and why didn't I get a copy. Or is this like the EULAs of software, in that when you open the box, you find a piece of paper that reads, "By reading this paper you have agreed to our contract. Your soul are belong to us." |
[ Reply to This ]
- Re: by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Tuesday, May 07 @ 16:55:20 EDT
- Re: by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Thursday, May 09 @ 12:06:51 EDT
- Re: Contract by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Saturday, May 11 @ 18:53:50 EDT
- Re: Contract Law, first semester by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Thursday, May 09 @ 17:44:30 EDT
- Re: whacko by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Thursday, May 09 @ 22:24:07 EDT
Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes (Score: 1, Insighful) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Friday, May 03 @ 14:09:11 EDT | When will these arrogant pieces of crap admit that they're not interested in running a market, but in creating a fiefdom? I mean, even the most blatant market fundamentalist will admit that PVRs are legitimate technical advances that will rightly change the structure of the market. If Turner or any other broadcasting company can't hack changes in the market, then they should get out of it. Don't try to change the rules of the game in the fourth quarter by bribing our "elected" officials.
Of course, if our so-called representatives in government would bother to enforce antitrust law and FCC regs properly, none of these media companies would have become powerful and arrogant enough to cause this kind of trouble. |
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Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes (Score: 0) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Friday, May 03 @ 14:28:33 EDT | Go to the bathroom too much and you are a thief.
Presumably the incontinent will be required by law to wear diapers while watching television? |
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Kellner's argument is a house of cards.... (Score: 1, Insighful) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Friday, May 03 @ 17:22:36 EDT | His first argument is that we, as viewers, enter into some type of implied contract when we turn on the television......regardless of signing anything, the notion of a contract between two parties is that both parties understand the terms and agree to trade something of value for a mutually benificial outcome.
My understanding of the terms (of our implied contract) is that he (Kellner) has the OPPORTUNITY to pitch some commercial at me. There's no gaurantee that the commercial will get through, or that I'll even be in front of the TV when he makes it! In essence, he's got the same chance as a US Mail spammer or telemarketer....perhaps he will get through...perhaps not.....that's all I'm willing to agree to....
Without a clear statement of the terms of a contract, there can be no contract......
The second problem with his argument is that he pre-supposes that he has something "valuable" to trade. Without the exchange, there is no contract, there's only a statement by one party that something will be done. That's fine, but it's not a contract.
By definition, free television is exactly that....I'm getting "entertained" if you want to call it that....and he's got the opportunity to pitch. The more entertaining he makes his "intellectual property," the more likely that I'll be sitting there to see his pitch. There are no guarantee's here. For instance, the junk-mailer buys the stamp for his pitch whether I open that credit card application or not. Would his argument be valid with mail? What about my secretary, who throws out all junk mail, is she breaking the law by performing her duty?
I wonder how many people would continue to watch television if they were bound by the rules of his "contract," i.e. no bathroom breaks, no skipping of commercials, must watch screen and have sound turned up during commercials, etc., etc., (insert tons of small print here...). |
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Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes (Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Saturday, May 04 @ 00:38:17 EDT | Don't forget that according to the EULA that came with the latest Time magazine, you must read pages 1-28 including all ads before reading the story you want on page 29. You must then read the rest of the mag. You must do this on the day you get the mag. You must not share the mag with a friend or read any page again that you have previously read. |
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Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes (Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Saturday, May 04 @ 08:22:50 EDT | Its simple ladies and gentleman. If you want to put a stop to this idiotic asinine trend that is being touted by the overzealous greedy legal mouthpieces of these corporations. Then let them go right ahead and do it. It will fail and it will fail miserably. Why because consumers run the market not them something they fail to understand again and again. Current copyright law whether you like it or not works and is in the best interests of both the consumer and the producers of the material. So why change it.
Good case in point of current copyright law working is the Nabster madness. Nabster was clearly in the wrong and got a good hand slapping for it.
A good case in point using the proposed changes is the MP4 standards saga. The MP4 rights holders went (on the advice of legal services) and changed the rules in midstream with ridicules licensing demands. The response from the developers building technologies around the new standard was take a flying leap we will develop our own standards based on open source.
Two things will happen if these so called powers that be get their way with the bills that are before Parliament in Canada and the House in the US.
1/ The consumer will be put in the position of being turned into a criminal no matter how honest they are so why bother. The legislation will be ignored and openly in your face broken by the more outspoken consumers.
2/ They will price themselves out of the market. Consumers will simply not buy it because the price is too high. It comes down to OK I paid for it I listened to it but if I want to listen to it again I have to pay (a smaller fee) to listen to it again even though I paid for a copy of it already???? Huh?????? This will encourage copyright infringement not discourage it. In other words they will make the situation worse.
Copyright (in its present form) is there to protect all of us the producers and the consumers of the material. No it is not perfect but it does work when it is applied honestly and fairly to everyone’s benefit. The wisdom of those who framed and wrote these laws is very apparent when you see idiotic challenges like these ones being made against them.
I’m very much against these changes to the copyright acts. I would be effectively be come a criminal over night simply because I own a computer, video tapes and the like. I like to buy a good movie and I buy a lot of them. And yes I really do have legal licenses for all of the software that I have on my computer. And darn it I like to write those little lisp routines, menu macros, scripts, and automated template files for AutoCAD and give them away for free. Under these proposed laws if I don’t register it or imbed copyright code into it I’m a criminal. Yes I can still give it away for free but I have to pay someone who had absolutely no input into its creation so I can do so. Excuse me but whom the hell are you???? God???? Well if this law passes it looks like I’ll be branded a renegade because there is no way in hell anyone is going to make me pay them to give away something I created for free.
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Copywritten??? (Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Saturday, May 04 @ 14:21:59 EDT | Someone who is supposedly a big-shot copyright expert should know that it's "copyrighted", not "copywritten". |
[ Reply to This ]
- Re: Copywritten??? by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Tuesday, May 07 @ 16:51:56 EDT
- Re: Copywritten??? by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Thursday, May 09 @ 11:23:01 EDT
Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes (Score: 0) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Saturday, May 04 @ 17:09:35 EDT | Dear Mr. Kellner,
In regards to this and all other "Social Contract" arguments (i.e. those which propose that my enjoyment of certain rights and luxuries implies my accord with whatever terms are tacitly dictated by the supplier) I say, "bullshit." A valid contract is explicit and freely accepted by all parties. If any party is unaware of or unwilling to accept the terms of the contract, it cannot exist. I was unaware of my "responsibility" to watch every commercial that interrupts my viewing experience. Now that I am aware of your terms, I can state without reservation that I refuse to accept them. The contract you propose is both unfair and unworkable. Luckily for the both of us, I have a counteroffer for you.
If commercials are appealing and entertaining in themselves (and here I am reminded of recent spots for Dell and Gateway computers, Hungry Man frozen dinners, and Rolling Rock ale) I will watch them, and if the products are attractive enough, I will buy them. You have the opportunity to compel me, and the opportunity to sell me. Nothing more and nothing less.
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Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes (Score: 0) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Sunday, May 05 @ 23:17:49 EDT | ok, what I don't get is, the part that sais "if you don't buy what's advertised you are stealing" Like look at the car ads! Who in their right mind has the money to buy every single car advertised, oh wait, that corperate bigwig does. Sorry, the average person doesn't have the money to buy every single thing that's advertised. gimme a break. I'll flick through commercials if I want, I'll go to the washroom when I want, I'll BUY what I want, not what some corperate nit wit tells me to buy. |
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Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes (Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Monday, May 06 @ 00:57:21 EDT | Someone's going to have to recognize that once we've entered the digital world people can send out perfect copies without any costs to large numbers of people in many different territories of the world...
This is where the MPAA/RIAA need to get on the bandwagon. If they could distribute their wares for little/no cost they would be raking in a lot more money. If I could have a high-enough-speed connection to the internet and my pal across the country could too, why would I want to act as the server for a movie or song if I could get it legally at a reasonable price. All the MPAA/RIAA needs to do is provide me content at reasonable prices (far less than they do today), help me get a high-enough-speed connection and allow me to use what they provided in my own way. If they don't do that, they will never succeed in providing the movie/song-on-demand, which they want to do. And stupid laws will be there to ruin this (IMO) already failing country. |
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What is the product? (Score: 2, Insighful) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Monday, May 06 @ 08:27:49 EDT | The guy is confused as to what the product of commercial TV is. It is not the content, it is the audience. Think how the money flows - advertizers pay TV station to show commercials, and they pay more when the audience is larger.
Unfortunately, I believe that TV advertising is not particularly effective, and the advertizers are getting ripped off. The business model of advert based TV is dying...
...richie ("too lazy to create an account") |
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Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes (Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Monday, May 06 @ 16:02:38 EDT | What about the networks side of this so-called "implied contract"? When I turn on the TV, I want to see good content. Most of the time I get trash. Are the networks "stealing" from me because they waste my time by providing this junk? If we all want to turn this whole TV viewing thing into a "real" contract where I am contractually obligated to watch the commercials, I want the networks to be contractually obligated to provide good wholesome family entertainment and educational programming instead of the morally corrupt mindless drivel they currently provide. |
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Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes (Score: 0) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Tuesday, May 07 @ 01:26:57 EDT | I wonder if these guys ever watched any of their own programming...mainly on the frebnch Revolution? I mean their arrogence is so obsured, that if they ever tried to do anythign liek that I'm sure people would be storming their "bastile" and basicly overthrowing anything they try and do.
One of the most outragious things I've also read is that the RIAA has used their muscle in canada to get a bill in motion to put a $3 tax per giga-byte on any portable MP3 player.
Do these people really think they can control us? Do they think they can make the decisions on what we want to watch and listion to? I mean if they really could, wouldn't Emeril still be on the air?
Well I'm going to go download some MP3's and a few movies off IRC, just to throw a little more gas on the fire
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Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes (Score: 0) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Tuesday, May 07 @ 11:26:07 EDT | There is a simple solution to all of this: boycott television.
Kellner may be one of the more egregious @!#%#$ in the industry but his notions of fairness and propriety are likely to be widely held by his counterparts. The message is clear: we the people are commodities that TV networks sell to advertisers. The good news is that we can voluntarily withdraw from the entire seedy relationship simply by turning off the tube. TV is not a necessity, it's even only arguably a luxury, but it is undoubtedly a time-tested means of mass consumer hypnosis.
We are not (yet) compelled to participate in our own degradation so long as we can pull the plug. Arguing for our right to be manipulated by the Kellners of the world is tantamount to staying in the cage even though the door is wide open ("But", we say, "Friends is on!").
It's not about the content. Even "good" TV, is, one must admit, only good when judged against the usual crap. The medium is the message, and the message is that TV does not love you, TV is not interested in what you want, TV is not interested in enlightening you, entertaining you, or even helping you pass a few worthless hours. TV is only interested in making you buy. Caveat emptor!
Of course TV seems pleasant. So does heroin, at least at first. When it stops feeling good you keep doing it just to avoid feeling bad.
If we simply stop watching, we deny television executives the rent-free use of our brains and the brains of our children.
Unplug it! |
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Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes (Score: 0) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Tuesday, May 07 @ 16:09:49 EDT | Darn all those little kids for stealing from PBS!!!!! I mean come on, what do you expect the youngins to do that watch mr. rodgers and sesame street? Send in their donations of a nickel? People pay more for stations that don't have the annoyance of commercials and show good shows... it's called premium service. |
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Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes (Score: 0) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Tuesday, May 07 @ 16:33:42 EDT | Ha ha - I haven't laughed so much in a long time, thankyou for making my day.
Richard Mahoney Editor - The Chaos Engine 2.0 http://www.the-chaos-engine.20m.com
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Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes (Score: 0) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Wednesday, May 08 @ 01:59:54 EDT | If I remember a tune and hum it in the shower, should I expect mr kellner's mind police to come a-knocking? Or if I memorise a passage from a book? Or a poem ?? Doesn't that constitute "illegal copying", after all, I'm storing the material in a memory device.
Where will it end ? |
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Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes (Score: 0) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Wednesday, May 08 @ 02:26:42 EDT | OK, this is still America. I'm a free man. Try to make me sit in front of the TV when the restroom calls. Try to make me watch commercials. Anyways, that's why I only watch movie channels! hahahaahahaaha I can't remember the last time I saw someone jump up from the tube and say "Wow! I've got to run right out and buy that!" Oh yeah I do remember, NEVER! funny stuff never happen |
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Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes (Score: 0) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Wednesday, May 08 @ 07:03:06 EDT | He is on DRUGS. I choose to:
1) turn off the radio
2) turn off the TV
3) refuse subscriptions to newspapers
4) refuse subscriptions to magazines
What copyrights have I stolen? As I said, he is on DRUGS if those are the 10 top copyright crimes. |
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Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes (Score: 0) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Wednesday, May 08 @ 07:41:57 EDT | Back here in the good old United Kingdom we've had the ideal system from the very beginnings of television - after all we did invent that wonderful device !
We have an annual license fee that everyone with a TV pays to the government. In return they give that money to that venerable institution, the British Broadcasting Corporation, to produce quality free television programmes with no advertising at all.
By contrast, the whole focus of US TV seems to be on advertising with occasional snippets of programming to keep the potential buyer entertained and engaged. In fact, the state of US TV is often used as a compelling argument to retain our license fee system, so the aforementioned copyright stupidity doesn't surprise me.
As for these ad-skipping devices - maybe the death of both adverts and ad-supported progammes would be a good thing, a chance to start again.
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Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes (Score: 0) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Wednesday, May 08 @ 09:24:16 EDT | Most of TV is crap, repeats etc. looking at it another way, only the commercials are actually new on many channels..... |
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Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes (Score: 1, Insighful) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Wednesday, May 08 @ 12:20:48 EDT | What is truly outrageous about Kellner's statements is that the Federal Government literally gave away for free the rights to the digital spectrum that is being used for High Definition TV. That's right. AOL-TW, Viacom, GE, etc., got those airwaves for FREE!
So if you ask me, Kellner and his ilk have an extremely strong implied contract with every US citizen to provide the maximum in entertainment and information value at the minimum price seeing as how they are being subsidized by every single US taxpayer! |
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Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes (Score: 0) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Wednesday, May 08 @ 14:55:20 EDT | Kellner claims that networks should get paid by the manufacturers of products who air commercials, and also by the viewers who choose not to view those commercials. The only place where all of the consumer wealth goes to one location is in a Socialist society.
The funding flow in a typical democracy in this scenario is such: The consumer pays the manufacturer for the product. The manufacturer of the product pays the network to air its commercials, but that is where it stops. Where is my kickback from the network for buying my time sitting in front of the television?
Kellner has these paranoid thoughts of all these new inventions coming on the market. I bet he has no problem with the invention of the TV. I wonder if novel publishers should sue Kellner because of the drop in book sales after television first started broadcasting. |
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Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes (Score: 0) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Wednesday, May 08 @ 18:46:39 EDT | So I would be criminal if i decide not lo let Corporated
Networks wash my brain...
No, thanks, I'll be in the park playing until big brother
license the air we breath with an EULA contract, then...
guess what. |
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Postcards in Magazines (Score: 0) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Wednesday, May 08 @ 19:13:57 EDT | Will I be breaking the law if I remove the annoying postcards (loose or attached) in every magazine I receive?
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Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes (Score: 0) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Thursday, May 09 @ 10:17:07 EDT | I love it! I didn't realize that there was a contract between myself and the shows that I've watched. Where is this person's address? I want to write them and have them send me money that they clearly owe me for the time I've wasted watching those terrible shows on tv.
I mean they advertised them as good, quality shows and they breached their agreement. So I want my money back. That's what happens when you breach a contract saying that you were going to do something and you don't deliver. or are they just forming one way contracts? I hate to say that there is no such thing as a one way contact. Also, since they have entered into an agreement with me to watch (and potentially) buy these products, don't they need to stand behind the ab machine that I bought that doesn't work? What they don't guarantee the products in those commercials? I didn't see any disclaimers on the show.
Also, these contacts are frauds. I start watching these shows based on their allegation that the show is a half-hour or an hour long. It turns out that's a lie! The last hour show I watched turned out only to be fourty minutes! They counted my paying them by watching their commercials as part of the programming that I supposedly paid for!
Overall, this person is clearly an idiot. I'm more than happy to support a contract position between myself and the producers of the complete garbage that they call entertainment. Hey how about this, just do away with television and I'll have to do something else with my time. Gasp!
Certain businesses are trying to equate "viewing (or copying) without permission" the same as Illegal viewing (or copying). Guess what? they are not the same! |
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Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes (Score: 0) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Thursday, May 09 @ 18:25:55 EDT | The biggest copyright crime is exclusion.
I am an electrician and "I want intellectual propety rights" the concept of recieveing royalties for work you've done once over and over again is GREAT. But why not us blue collar citizens. I realize that metalica and those other over the hill rock stars are getting to old to look respectable jumping around on stage and must rely on royalties to see further income. I will soon be too old to look respectable climbing ladders and running wire. However, I have wired thousands of houses and when there is a transfer of real property why should the owner sell my work that I sold only to him without paying me a freaking royalty??????? Fair is fair, equitable across the board. Certainly the original owner is free to use my work or let guest and family members use my work without an additional fee. But when my work is sold why should I not get a fee???? This would seem to follow the same legal argument. And what about the plumber, the heating mechanic, the mason, the carpenter, etc.
Why is this right of intellectual property only extended to a certain fee professions?
I WANT INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY RIGHTS!!!!!!!
Maybe my contracts should include a copyright clause? Hey what an idea!! What do you think?
Ed Nash (ednash@npcsecurity.com) |
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What kind of corporatist nonsense is this? (Score: 0) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Thursday, May 09 @ 21:06:27 EDT | I thought the airwaves belonged to the public, and this was a free country. This guy has some gall to argue that refusing to watch some insipid commercial about some product you can nor will buy is a crime. I think he's the criminal for even thinking about forcing people to watch commercials. What kind of corporatist dictator is he? Where does he get off telling me that I have no right to change channels during commercials? It's no crime not to watch commercials, and if Moneybags, Inc. doesn't like it, then too damned bad! |
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Re: Top Ten New Copyright Crimes (Score: 0) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Thursday, May 09 @ 22:15:25 EDT | MY GOD!!!How did this NUT get loose?????..They
must be really hard-up for execs at Turners.This guy belongs in a padded cell.Hey TED!This guy is the " kiss of death to your company.He,s an embarressment to all the 'sane' people at Turners.Get rid of him.!!!! |
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Mr. Kellner I agree 100%. (Score: 0) by Anonymous (Name Withheld on Advice of Counsel) on Saturday, May 11 @ 06:42:58 EDT | I really like the ideas you have, as a matter of fact I'd already thought of some of them (great minds think alike). I'd really like to work with you, for you, to see the realization of these concepts. I'm vehemently against such theft as you talked about. I've already turned in 10 people, who I found with illegally copied mp3 files, to the RIAA (two of which were family members). If I can be of any service to you, please email me at anon1978@hotmail.com. I apologize for the anonymous email address, but you can never be too carefull with all these thieves on the Internet. |
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